6 questions about watches I can't figure out

[$BarHat$]

fellows, hello, over there!!!!
nice to meet u here, seems like a cozy place!
I've got some questions that I have collected over time about watches. in fact, I know a thing or two about watches, especially more about dials, the most popular and less popular brands, reps vs genuine, etc... that is, somewhat superficial information)))))
but since I got into this hobby, I'm facing more and more terms that I don't really understand. and please, don't advise me to read articles on Google about them, because I've already done it, and I can't say that I've clarified myself 🫣🫣🫣🫣🫣. the language is way too twisted there. therefore, please explain more to like a nerd DDDDD
if it's ok for you, I'll leave here a list of questions that bother me. you, in your turn, answer the ones you know, I will be grateful for any feedback. in this way, I will have everything structured and it will be easier for me to orient myself))

by the way, you will also find many abbreviations, which I will ask you to clarify for me

1. I see a lot of information, especially in the description of replica watches, about DLC and PVD. what exactly do these refer to? and what is the difference, and their benefits and, respectively, their shortcomings? which ones are better?
2. what exactly is the difference between an automatic and a kinetic watch? I mean, I understand the specifics of the automatic ones. but it's hard for me to mess with these kinetics. what is their specificity?
3. what about hacking secs? what do they mean?
4. I understood the Nato straps thing. but what about bond, and maratac types of straps?
5. why is the world so "hungry" for diver watches? do so many people do diving?
6. and the last one, sandwich dial????????? I know about panda dial. but "sandwich"??? what's up with it?🫣🫣🫣🫣

Get ready! Set! Go! And thank you, guys!

 

[Matias]

some questions ???????? u wanted to say "a ton of questions"
and yes, you can easily find most reviews on google))))). I think you didn't search well))))))))) though, my friend, I will answer a few, which I know better)))
-for the 2nd question, with kinetic and automatic. there is nothing complicated here. with automatic mechanisms, there is a spring winding. the kinetic ones work on the basis of a battery or capacitor. as a rule, in most cases, the kinetic ones perform a longer activity, in the context of a less frequent winding. that is, they can work even for a few months. in contrast, the automatic ones have a reduced power reserve, respectively perform for a shorter time and are more dependent on the winding than the kinetic ones.

-for question no. 3, it's still simple. you follow the seconds and stop them when you need it , or when you need to synchronize them with the hours and minutes. that is, you hack their operation. DDDD

-question 4: actually, everything started with nato straps. they have a certain standard. zulu are similar to nato, only they are thicker. Bond is exactly the same as NATO, they are more or less synonymous. sometimes, Bond straps can come in different options of 3/4/ or 5 rings. and Maratac is nothing but the brand of Zulu/nato bands. I don't know if there is an exact formula of characteristics. they vary slightly between them, but sometimes they are almost identical.

don't thank me

 

[Simposium5338]

some questions ???????? u wanted to say "a ton of questions"
and yes, you can easily find most reviews on google))))). I think you didn't search well))))))))) though, my friend, I will answer a few, which I know better)))
-for the 2nd question, with kinetic and automatic. there is nothing complicated here. with automatic mechanisms, there is a spring winding. the kinetic ones work on the basis of a battery or capacitor. as a rule, in most cases, the kinetic ones perform a longer activity, in the context of a less frequent winding. that is, they can work even for a few months. in contrast, the automatic ones have a reduced power reserve, respectively perform for a shorter time and are more dependent on the winding than the kinetic ones.

-for question no. 3, it's still simple. you follow the seconds and stop them when you need it , or when you need to synchronize them with the hours and minutes. that is, you hack their operation. DDDD

-question 4: actually, everything started with nato straps. they have a certain standard. zulu are similar to nato, only they are thicker. Bond is exactly the same as NATO, they are more or less synonymous. sometimes, Bond straps can come in different options of 3/4/ or 5 rings. and Maratac is nothing but the brand of Zulu/nato bands. I don't know if there is an exact formula of characteristics. they vary slightly between them, but sometimes they are almost identical.

don't thank me

I would add here that zulu/nato/bond are more viable types of straps than rubber ones. they are made of durable nylon that lasts over time. rubber tends to crumble over time, and the skin under them does not breathe. the nylon is even more welcome than leather straps. at least for me, a nylon strap is much more comfortable than a rubber or leather one.


-PVD stands for Physical Vapor Deposition. DLC refers to Diamond-Like Carbon. These refer to a kind of material used for plating the outer surface of watches. And they are not only for reps, but also for original watches as well. I hear that the world embraces DLC more than PVD. but to be honest, I don't really understand why, because from the watches I had both with pvd and with dlc, I didn't notice a big difference. over time, either way, scratches appear on both types.

Your question about divers: it seems to me that they simply have a very successful design that makes them both noticeable and comfortable, and practical for every day. I don't really think that people take them specifically for their diving ability. many simply love the idea that the watch is very resistant to water, even if they go diving once a year

 

[DomPerignon]

some questions ???????? u wanted to say "a ton of questions"
and yes, you can easily find most reviews on google))))). I think you didn't search well))))))))) though, my friend, I will answer a few, which I know better)))
-for the 2nd question, with kinetic and automatic. there is nothing complicated here. with automatic mechanisms, there is a spring winding. the kinetic ones work on the basis of a battery or capacitor. as a rule, in most cases, the kinetic ones perform a longer activity, in the context of a less frequent winding. that is, they can work even for a few months. in contrast, the automatic ones have a reduced power reserve, respectively perform for a shorter time and are more dependent on the winding than the kinetic ones.

-for question no. 3, it's still simple. you follow the seconds and stop them when you need it , or when you need to synchronize them with the hours and minutes. that is, you hack their operation. DDDD

-question 4: actually, everything started with nato straps. they have a certain standard. zulu are similar to nato, only they are thicker. Bond is exactly the same as NATO, they are more or less synonymous. sometimes, Bond straps can come in different options of 3/4/ or 5 rings. and Maratac is nothing but the brand of Zulu/nato bands. I don't know if there is an exact formula of characteristics. they vary slightly between them, but sometimes they are almost identical.

don't thank me

"the kinetic ones work on the basis of a battery" - u missed mentioningthe innovative rechargeable battery

sandwich dial??????!!!!!! also, curious about that....

 

[MCGregor]

some questions ???????? u wanted to say "a ton of questions"
and yes, you can easily find most reviews on google))))). I think you didn't search well))))))))) though, my friend, I will answer a few, which I know better)))
-for the 2nd question, with kinetic and automatic. there is nothing complicated here. with automatic mechanisms, there is a spring winding. the kinetic ones work on the basis of a battery or capacitor. as a rule, in most cases, the kinetic ones perform a longer activity, in the context of a less frequent winding. that is, they can work even for a few months. in contrast, the automatic ones have a reduced power reserve, respectively perform for a shorter time and are more dependent on the winding than the kinetic ones.

-for question no. 3, it's still simple. you follow the seconds and stop them when you need it , or when you need to synchronize them with the hours and minutes. that is, you hack their operation. DDDD

-question 4: actually, everything started with nato straps. they have a certain standard. zulu are similar to nato, only they are thicker. Bond is exactly the same as NATO, they are more or less synonymous. sometimes, Bond straps can come in different options of 3/4/ or 5 rings. and Maratac is nothing but the brand of Zulu/nato bands. I don't know if there is an exact formula of characteristics. they vary slightly between them, but sometimes they are almost identical.

don't thank me

also puzzled here about the many straps types....
so, if i figure it out right, it turns out that there are 2 basic types of straps, i.e. zulu and nato. are the rest just variations and names that also refer to these types? am I right????


-as for divers, any watch that officially comes with the suffix "diver" is not just a label for marketing. before being launched, they must be subjected to the pressure test. if they resist, they are assigned this "descriptive". you can find many watches that say they are resistant up to 200 meters, but they are not officially confirmed as divers. this means that technically, they are able to resist, only that no one guarantees absolute resistance).
so it depends on which divers we are talking about))) at least, in the replica industry, there is no diver by definition))) because none of them have confirmed resistance to pressure. it's just pure theory) respectively, if we take into account how many people buy "divers" rep watches, the reason is purely the aesthetics of the watch, not the water resistance of hundreds of meters)

 

[Skorsese]

also puzzled here about the many straps types....
so, if i figure it out right, it turns out that there are 2 basic types of straps, i.e. zulu and nato. are the rest just variations and names that also refer to these types? am I right????


-as for divers, any watch that officially comes with the suffix "diver" is not just a label for marketing. before being launched, they must be subjected to the pressure test. if they resist, they are assigned this "descriptive". you can find many watches that say they are resistant up to 200 meters, but they are not officially confirmed as divers. this means that technically, they are able to resist, only that no one guarantees absolute resistance).
so it depends on which divers we are talking about))) at least, in the replica industry, there is no diver by definition))) because none of them have confirmed resistance to pressure. it's just pure theory) respectively, if we take into account how many people buy "divers" rep watches, the reason is purely the aesthetics of the watch, not the water resistance of hundreds of meters)

that's how it is) we got used to the term "diver" for everything that has water resistance, no matter the atm) but in fact, a "diver" is really a technical description, confirmed only by pressure resistance. if you compare a Gshock with the same resistance as a Frogman, they are actually totally different. one is diver, the other is not, just because of the tested standard

 

[$BarHat$]

some questions ???????? u wanted to say "a ton of questions"
and yes, you can easily find most reviews on google))))). I think you didn't search well))))))))) though, my friend, I will answer a few, which I know better)))
-for the 2nd question, with kinetic and automatic. there is nothing complicated here. with automatic mechanisms, there is a spring winding. the kinetic ones work on the basis of a battery or capacitor. as a rule, in most cases, the kinetic ones perform a longer activity, in the context of a less frequent winding. that is, they can work even for a few months. in contrast, the automatic ones have a reduced power reserve, respectively perform for a shorter time and are more dependent on the winding than the kinetic ones.

-for question no. 3, it's still simple. you follow the seconds and stop them when you need it , or when you need to synchronize them with the hours and minutes. that is, you hack their operation. DDDD

-question 4: actually, everything started with nato straps. they have a certain standard. zulu are similar to nato, only they are thicker. Bond is exactly the same as NATO, they are more or less synonymous. sometimes, Bond straps can come in different options of 3/4/ or 5 rings. and Maratac is nothing but the brand of Zulu/nato bands. I don't know if there is an exact formula of characteristics. they vary slightly between them, but sometimes they are almost identical.

don't thank me

uhhhh, what a detailed answer))))
clearly google is a possible answer to the question, but believe me I messed it up....haha..and I messed up harder than I was at the beginning. communication with the real world seems more explicit to me, u know? I hope I didn't steal much of your time


and yes, I DO thank u

 

[$BarHat$]

also puzzled here about the many straps types....
so, if i figure it out right, it turns out that there are 2 basic types of straps, i.e. zulu and nato. are the rest just variations and names that also refer to these types? am I right????


-as for divers, any watch that officially comes with the suffix "diver" is not just a label for marketing. before being launched, they must be subjected to the pressure test. if they resist, they are assigned this "descriptive". you can find many watches that say they are resistant up to 200 meters, but they are not officially confirmed as divers. this means that technically, they are able to resist, only that no one guarantees absolute resistance).
so it depends on which divers we are talking about))) at least, in the replica industry, there is no diver by definition))) because none of them have confirmed resistance to pressure. it's just pure theory) respectively, if we take into account how many people buy "divers" rep watches, the reason is purely the aesthetics of the watch, not the water resistance of hundreds of meters)

and it's the first time to know that...... see? @Matias? google didn't offer me such specific details

 

[MinervuS]

In short: kinetic vs automatic: you are not dependent on the battery at all. The difference lies in the price. from the perspective of functionality, both have pluses and minuses. however, they are more accessible than hand wound mechanisms.
hacking hands are not very useful. it's for a very narrow niche. why do you need this function, if you have an automatic or kinetic watch?!

 

[$BarHat$]

In short: kinetic vs automatic: you are not dependent on the battery at all. The difference lies in the price. from the perspective of functionality, both have pluses and minuses. however, they are more accessible than hand wound mechanisms.
hacking hands are not very useful. it's for a very narrow niche. why do you need this function, if you have an automatic or kinetic watch?!

not that I want hackingh and in my watch. I do not associate this type of hands with a mechanical or kinetic watch at all. the questions are not related to each other.)))) I just didn't understand the specifics of hacking hands in general ))))

 

[Eddie]

it is not necessary that zulu and nato types of straps are specifically made of nylon. it is true that this is the basic material, but not the only one. to be more clear, someone pointed out well here that Maratec is the direct brand name. by the way, I have only positive feedback about it. Respectively, Nato and zulu refer directly to the type of band. and Bond type variations and stuff like that refer to appearance and design. this is a very general explanation, with hundreds of specifications that I don't think I need to go into....

Nato, as a rule, is the strictest option, that is, it falls below the British military standard and deviations are not really accepted. it usually comes as a two-piece band. Bond has 2 distinctive stripes that refer to James Bond.

 

[EuGeniuS]

if I'm not mistaken, panerai is a good example of sandwich dials. they differ from other types in their multiple levels. at first glance, there is not much difference. but a professional eye will notice that the multiple layers add a depth effect. there is something attractive about these dials....


ps: not my pic))))

 

[Eddie]

I was just trying to find an example of a sandwich dial, and it seems that I found it. also, it's not my personal watch, but it's a good example of a somewhat deep dial....
this depth is the result of the sandwich technique. if you look carefully, you notice that the lum dial is somehow on top, and the numbers seem to be cut out. and already the black base seems the deepest. am I the only one noticing it?!!!!🫣🫣🫣🫣🫣

 

[Eddie]

also puzzled here about the many straps types....
so, if i figure it out right, it turns out that there are 2 basic types of straps, i.e. zulu and nato. are the rest just variations and names that also refer to these types? am I right????


-as for divers, any watch that officially comes with the suffix "diver" is not just a label for marketing. before being launched, they must be subjected to the pressure test. if they resist, they are assigned this "descriptive". you can find many watches that say they are resistant up to 200 meters, but they are not officially confirmed as divers. this means that technically, they are able to resist, only that no one guarantees absolute resistance).
so it depends on which divers we are talking about))) at least, in the replica industry, there is no diver by definition))) because none of them have confirmed resistance to pressure. it's just pure theory) respectively, if we take into account how many people buy "divers" rep watches, the reason is purely the aesthetics of the watch, not the water resistance of hundreds of meters)

zulu has a unique structure, consisting of one whole piece, nato is a little different, because it consists of 2 pieces that combine together and form one. the specific bond is the 2 stripes, as already mentioned.

 

[EuGeniuS]

I would add here that zulu/nato/bond are more viable types of straps than rubber ones. they are made of durable nylon that lasts over time. rubber tends to crumble over time, and the skin under them does not breathe. the nylon is even more welcome than leather straps. at least for me, a nylon strap is much more comfortable than a rubber or leather one.


-PVD stands for Physical Vapor Deposition. DLC refers to Diamond-Like Carbon. These refer to a kind of material used for plating the outer surface of watches. And they are not only for reps, but also for original watches as well. I hear that the world embraces DLC more than PVD. but to be honest, I don't really understand why, because from the watches I had both with pvd and with dlc, I didn't notice a big difference. over time, either way, scratches appear on both types.

Your question about divers: it seems to me that they simply have a very successful design that makes them both noticeable and comfortable, and practical for every day. I don't really think that people take them specifically for their diving ability. many simply love the idea that the watch is very resistant to water, even if they go diving once a year

I agree with you about the DLC. sources say that it must withstand much better minor impacts and scratches. but I did not notice such an effect on the watches I had. if you have a choice between these 2, it's still better to go for the DLC version than PVD. at least theoretically, they are more resistant

 

[EuGeniuS]

also puzzled here about the many straps types....
so, if i figure it out right, it turns out that there are 2 basic types of straps, i.e. zulu and nato. are the rest just variations and names that also refer to these types? am I right????


-as for divers, any watch that officially comes with the suffix "diver" is not just a label for marketing. before being launched, they must be subjected to the pressure test. if they resist, they are assigned this "descriptive". you can find many watches that say they are resistant up to 200 meters, but they are not officially confirmed as divers. this means that technically, they are able to resist, only that no one guarantees absolute resistance).
so it depends on which divers we are talking about))) at least, in the replica industry, there is no diver by definition))) because none of them have confirmed resistance to pressure. it's just pure theory) respectively, if we take into account how many people buy "divers" rep watches, the reason is purely the aesthetics of the watch, not the water resistance of hundreds of meters)

you are right, only partially. when it comes to depth and testing, it's not about only the depth itself, but also how long it lasts, that is, the time period in which the watch remains resistant under water is also tested. brands spend a lot of money when it comes to ISO. it's a very expensive test, but also very detailed, from all perspectives.

even so, the watches that were not necessarily confirmed as divers through testing, this does not speak of the fact that they could not be used in the depths and diving. a good example is Casio, which has improved its water resistance properties in such a way that the watches withstand even professional diving. this is due to the design of the 4 screws. however, let's not forget that water resistance also depends on gaskets, not just screws. in casio, this detail is also very well done, where the screwback has the gasket and screw threads to protect against water

 

[CosmoS]

for testing diver watches, there is a whole epic of tests and standards. it is most likely that the watches fall under the incidence of the ISO 6425 regulation when it comes to water resistance. good to know some of the details here

 

[CosmoS]

PVD has already existed in the industry for a very long time, since 1840, approximately. It refers in particular to a vacuum deposition after which a layer of vaporized material is applied. it is used not only for watches, but also for various other surfaces. in watches, this technique usually results in a flat black finish (not always black). reliable manufacturers apply this technique to both watch cases and metal bracelets. in the replica industry, few factories apply it, that's why some replicas have a not shiny and perfect surface, for saving purposes. expensive reps and more expensive originals usually have this layer and it makes the stainless steel look much more cosmetic and withstand minor impacts much better.
the material is very firmly attached to the base material, to stainless steel for example. the advantage is that it does not flake off over time, because it is applied after processing up to 400 degrees Celsius. respectively, it interpenetrates with the base material forming a whole. In cheap watches, including replicas, powder or paint spraying is used, which is faded off over time. In the case of DVP application, such an outcome is impossible.

There is another variation of this technique, namely CVD, which refers to chemical vapor deposition, and is somewhat more advanced. Unlike PVD that coats the surface, the CVD technique is applied after chemical reactions.
At Seiko and Casio there are a multitude of pvd watches, in which a variation of it is used, known as IP, which is Ion plating. it's something very similar, and actually refers to the same PVD.

 

[CosmoS]

DLC, you already know the full name, @$BarHat$ . the material itself includes hybridized carbon atoms. the purpose of DLC is to protect surfaces through the vapor deposition process and its properties are more or less similar to those of genuine diamond. consequently, it is not difficult to deduce why DLC is considered more durable. Technically, this compound is even more resistant than PVD. The question is how professionally the material is applied. Hence the divided opinions regarding its resistance. And don't forget that when a watchmaker promises that his watches are PVD coated, this does not necessarily mean that he is referring to DLC he can also refer to other materials, which he does not specify directly)))))): chromium niotride (silver tone), TiAIN/titanium aluminum nitride (bronze tone, or black), or TiN/titanium nitride (gold tone, etc).

to give you a clearer picture, here is a Panerai with DLC coating of my friend. By the way, it also has a sandwich dial that you are very curious about....I don't know how clear the image is to give you an idea, but it looks like this...

 

[CosmoS]

And if you still want and have patience to read about the pros and cons, here's what I have to say
EVERYTHING DEPENDS on the application technique and the professionalism of the producer. it depends on the thickness of the layer, the correct method, the correct processing temperature, etc... following all these factors, the durability of the material is directly proportional. it is practically impossible to detect how correctly and professionally the material was applied when you buy a new watch. it remains to trust or not the brand/factory that produced it.
of course, it also depends on the impact with which the watch interacts with other surfaces. of course, if it falls heavily, not only the PVD layer will suffer, but also the base material itself, which is usually stainless steel. in any case, if such an impact did happen, I know for sure that the specialists do NOT recommend a polish process. first of all, it will not solve the damage. secondly, the correct technique would be to first remove the PVD coating, to apply it repeatedly (to close all the cracks), and only then to polish.